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Player Inventory Limitations?

Discussion in 'Feature Suggestions' started by ThatOneGuy, Jun 24, 2014.

  1. tetryds

    tetryds cus tet, that's it

    • Member
    No I'm talking about science.
  2. Arctic

    Arctic Giant Robot Advocate

    • Tester
    I don't get it. Explain again?
  3. tetryds

    tetryds cus tet, that's it

    • Member
    1 block is 0.5mx0.5mx0.5m, that means that it occupies that volume in the world.
    If you are to store it somewhere, you need to put it inside something with 0.5mx0.5mx0.5m of free room.
    The same way as you can't store infinite milk on your refrigerator just because you put the first in there and all other magically stack together.
    That is the problem of playing too much minecraft you forget about this kind of stuff.

    So, we would need a way for something smaller than that volume to store such volume, and are thinking about ways that it could be done scientifically even if they are not really feasible IRL.
    tetryds, Jul 25, 2014
    Last edited by tetryds; at Jul 25, 2014
    #23
  4. Arctic

    Arctic Giant Robot Advocate

    • Tester
    Ah, I see. Maybe instead of going down the science route, we have the blocks stored on "Pallets", which would be very cheap, mass-producable, and allow you to remove blocks without breaking them?
    I feel that a more down-to-earth route would be more satisfying than just saying "SCIENCE" and having a bottomless box of gravel.
  5. PsychoticLeprechaun

    PsychoticLeprechaun Designer & Web Developer

    • Dev Member
    Well, I believe one method we want to try is something called a stockpile, which is inspired from Dwarf Fortress. These would likely allow the player to store several blocks per block of volume the stockpile takes up (e.g. 8 blocks per block space), though perhaps this value would become a 1:1 ratio in a hardcore mode. This makes storage more feasible for players, while still adhering to the whole idea of storage working in a realistic way. Whether that could have a scientific explanation, it could do, and the explanation I will give below for an example of how a player inventory could work might be able to tie in with that.

    So, as a player, you want to be able to hold items, but, if you want to play SoA, you also want a reasonably realistic and challenging experience. To hold to both, there is the possibility of explaining the player inventory through the PDA: the PDA being a computerised device, could have a section where it stores materials it gets hold of in almost-energy-form*, then when the player wants to access a particular item, the computer reconstructs it a la Star Trek's Transporter. This means that the limitation of the player's inventory would be the almost-energy capacity of this "inventory", and would also explain how the inventory would be a part of the PDA UI. This means that how much the player can carry within this inventory would be increased via upgrades to the PDA. In order to have quick access to certain items/tools, the tool bar that (was) is at the bottom of the screen could indicate tools the player is carrying physically, on e.g. a tool belt, this would mean that the weight element could still affect player ability to traverse land etc. but would be restricted to the tool belt (or perhaps to some degree items stored by the PDA would also contribute, but to a much lessened extent**).

    * I say almost-energy because, obviously, one must still have the necessary atoms on hand, but something quasi-physics that fits could be used here.

    ** We could utilise the idea that the PDA forces the Higgs field around the storage unit down to 0, or does so with some success, and so the mass of the contents is reduced through reducing the Higgs Effect. (This is quasi-physics too, but it is the best I could think of).

    So that's one example of how it could be explained, feel free to pick it apart, destroy it, etc. and be sure to provide your own alternative ideas!
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2014
    PsychoticLeprechaun, Jul 25, 2014
    Last edited by PsychoticLeprechaun; at Jul 25, 2014
    #25
    tetryds likes this.
  6. Agarthan

    Agarthan Reinvented The Wheel

    • Member
    That's almost exactly what I just proposed. Like it could start out damaged or something and only have very limited data space, but as you advanced you could create larger cells that are more energy efficient to store larger caches of items. Hell, may be even go the full - there is no tile entities for blocks when you break them you actually have to deal with their size as is - to start out with and you have to unlock better inventory abilities in the 'realism' mode of the game discussed in other threads.
  7. Agarthan

    Agarthan Reinvented The Wheel

    • Member
    May be more the terrafirmacraft route, like how wood stacks, or that certain items have a size and weight and therefore can only fit in certain things, in the case of TFC it's just one type of chest, but SOA could add different types of storage modules for different items/blocks. Though, I don't think a 1:1 ratio of the block size is the best idea, may be 1:4 or 1:6.
  8. ThatOneGuy

    ThatOneGuy Reinvented The Wheel

    • Member
    Through technology I suppose. Build yourself a truck, it will hold a few things.
  9. tetryds

    tetryds cus tet, that's it

    • Member
    Sorry, I was not suggesting having 1:1 storage, I was just saying that it's something people dont realize.

    I like your idea Matt, and I also like the idea of "being connected" to a bigger storage that can both take energy to run and more time to spawn the blocks from.
    Chests could also store blocks (only blocks) on a superdense state, you would not have to carry them, thus the extra weight would be fine, but you would still have to provide energy for it to stay stable.
    But using some method to transfer the item given the chest works like this would be more complicated.
    Maybe we can have two kinds of storage, being the former a smaller but accessible from range, and the last for massive storage.

    I love the truck idea, wonder how long would it take to make a truck in real life under a simmilar situation :p (joke, trucks would be indeed cool).
    tetryds, Jul 25, 2014
    Last edited by tetryds; at Jul 25, 2014
    #29
  10. slibbfalusken

    slibbfalusken Crash Landed

    • Member
    Just a quick idea. The PDA or backpack of yours could shrink the space between atoms to near zero thus making room for hundreds of blocks. To avoid a black hole the backpack would flatten out spacetime within it to make the objects unaffected by gravity.
  11. tetryds

    tetryds cus tet, that's it

    • Member
    Yeah, but to keep molecular integrity it would have to be cooled down a lot.
    A nice frosty and expanding effect when placing blocks would look neat.
  12. Arctic

    Arctic Giant Robot Advocate

    • Tester
    I think an issue we're having here is that we're thinking about it like this is going to be Minecraft. It won't be.
    We could go and make buildings extremely time-consuming and difficult to build. In Rust, you need to cut down hundreds of trees, mine a thousand metal ore, kill dozens of bears, just to build one measly house.
    In real life, buildings are not easy to make. Keep that in mind. Of course, as you build up a great and enormous empire, you will be able to hire NPC workers to do most of it for you, but still, if we make buildings harder to break into, perhaps a more realistic method of building could be favorable.
    We don't necessarily need to enable players to build to their heart's content.
    Of course, later in the game, players would be able to build things like vehicles, cranes, trucks as mentioned before, to aid them. But when just starting up, players would need to take shelter under caves, outcroppings, and holes. It would be more realistic, and induce a sense of fear and helplessness in early-game players.

    HOWEVER: I'm not at all suggesting that this be in the game. Just a thought is all. The subspace backpack sounds pretty good.
    ThatOneGuy likes this.
  13. tetryds

    tetryds cus tet, that's it

    • Member
    I don't think this is going to be something even remotely related to minecraft.
    But I understand what you are trying to say.
    Building can be complicated, just like it does IRL.
    Well, I feel we will have to sacrifice some of our "how would it be for real" there and allow the player to have a bit of freedom.
    People are using to building, we shouldn't make it an annoying process.
    We could for intance have some blocks that you cannot "zip" on an inventory and stuff like that, but I don't really see needs.
    I like Matt's idea of only masscarying blocks, and having items on an "utility belt".
  14. Arctic

    Arctic Giant Robot Advocate

    • Tester
    Agreed.
    The "Utility Belt" idea is interesting, though what if you want to carry tools you aren't using? Put them in your backpack?
  15. Agarthan

    Agarthan Reinvented The Wheel

    • Member
    I think the best idea that satisfies all the angles is; the previously mentioned in another thread; difficulty or 'realism' scale that allows the player to custom tailor their gameplay experience. This could determine all the factors mentioned in this thread.
    Agarthan, Jul 26, 2014
    Last edited by Agarthan; at Jul 26, 2014
    #35
  16. Restless

    Restless Terraformer

    • Member
    Could some kind of capsule technology work? Again explaining how the technology could work would be the real challenge, but if it could be explained even vaguely it could be a good workaround for storing blocks in a smaller space than they would normally occupy. I'm thinking a more believable version of what is seen in the Dragonball series. Tiny capsules no bigger than your thumb that in the show can store things as big as houses and more, and still remain light enough to carry around despite containing tonnes of mass. In the DB world they seem to be a widely used everyday commodity, like cars and washing machines.

    The capsules came in different capacities, and one character described a higher capacity capsule as expensive or outwith his usual price range (something like that, I'm very loosely paraphrasing). Perhaps a similarly inspired storage device could come in different types and capacities, with the player required to produce or buy them from another player who has produced them before getting to use them. It could help prevent the beginning from being too easy while still allowing for compressed storage later on.

    But the hardest part is trying to explain the technology. I don't know if storage capsules are too far out into the realm of sci-fi for SOA.
    Restless, Jul 26, 2014
    Last edited by Restless; at Jul 26, 2014
    #36
  17. tetryds

    tetryds cus tet, that's it

    • Member
    Spacetime distortion could be a solution for the volume storage, but it would require a constant input of energy.
    Maybe what Matt suggested, something like a transporter.
    You store your items on something like a chest, and conect your PDA to the chest (with limited range).
    Then you transport the block to place it down.
    About items, yes backpack would be cool :)
    If you won't use the item, don't bring it.
    Forgot your pistol and enemies showed up? Deal with it.
  18. Arctic

    Arctic Giant Robot Advocate

    • Tester
    There ought to be methods for storing more. Like holsters.
  19. PsychoticLeprechaun

    PsychoticLeprechaun Designer & Web Developer

    • Dev Member
    This wasn't quite what I meant, but it does sound like a really good extension of the idea, which was more that it was connected to a storage module on the PDA, so it was always with you.
  20. tetryds

    tetryds cus tet, that's it

    • Member
    Or have both, so the one you carry with you is smaller.

    We just need to find a way to negate the weight of the blocks.
Similar Threads: Inventory Limitations
Forum Title Date
Feature Suggestions add a favorite button to block in inventory Dec 6, 2015
Feature Suggestions Inventory: a crucial topic Aug 19, 2015
Feature Suggestions Physics Inventory Mar 15, 2014
Feature Suggestions PDA - Not just an inventory hologram. Feb 25, 2014

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